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[personal profile] garnigal
Bitch PhD posted a link to a woman who wrote about her experience with a possessive stalker ex. I've posted the link here as well.

http://bitchphd.blogspot.com/2006/06/really-good-read.html

Most people have some experience with unstable unpredictable people, even if it's second hand or through something they read. Unfortunately, many people have been in an uncomfortable, potentially dangerous situation and don't know how to remove themselves or don't trust their instincts enough to remove themselves.

As important as it is to read C.L. Hanson's tale of the stalking, I think it is just as important to read what Bitch PhD has to say about it. Her comments on the situation are all about trust and social conventions and ignoring social conventions for your own well-being. This is something I belive in strongly.

I've never been in a situation where someone is holding me hostage, but I have considered what I would do in that situation. And the answer is always - I would fight. I would fight to for my life, I would hurt, maim, even kill my attacker to save myself. This is true if it is a stranger on a dark street or an aquaintance who doesn't respect my physical boundries.

I encourage everyone who reads this post to consider what you would do in various dangerous situations. I hope no one I know is ever faced with making such a choice, but if you are, I want you to have a plan. Think now about what you would do, so you don't have to think about it in the moment.

The moment is time to act. Now is time to think.

Date: 2006-06-16 02:38 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sandraregina.livejournal.com
There is this line in the Bitch's post: "But most "advice" to women focuses on avoiding *situations*, rather than trusting yourself and avoiding *people* who make you feel uneasy. I think that's exactly backwards."

I completely agree with this. I have walked alone at night, often, and felt perfectly safe because I was alone or the people around were people I could deal with. I have also completely avoided certain streets in broad daylight because the people there made me feel uncomfortable.

So far I've been fortunate in that I've never been stalked. I was harassed a lot in school, and I got very good at feeling it coming and getting away. I try very hard not to react to people based solely on how they look (ie by race or piercings or tatoos or ratty clothes), but when I'm alone I do pay attention to people and the 'vibe' they give off, and get the hell out of Dodge as quickly as possible if they make me uncomfortable. Even if they are in a business suit.

Date: 2006-06-16 02:51 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] maes.livejournal.com
I agree 100%. However, sometimes no matter how hard you try to avoid a person or situation, the person or situation will come to you. I tried my best to avoid a bully in highschool and that bastard would seek me out no matter where I went. Then, I just sucked it up and endured because I didn't have any recourse. Now, if it were to happen again, I wouldn't hesitate to defend myself.

Date: 2006-06-16 02:51 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] garnigal.livejournal.com
I think it does help to have a certain amount of experience in the world. You and I have over 30 years of life behind us - even if we've never had the truly horrible experiences, we've lived through enough that we have a feel for unpleasant situations and people.

I worry most about younger people - about my friends little girls, my own cousins, my younger friends. I hope they don't have to go through something terrible, that they don't have to be hurt by a stranger, by someone they trusted or by a friend before they make the decision to trust themselves and to treat themselves as their most valuable resource. Not thier reputation or the "social rules" that tell us to ignore the uncomfortable, but thier bodies and thier mental health.

Date: 2006-06-16 03:28 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] whatawookie.livejournal.com
I think where the "fight" instinct falls through is that in a truly dangerous predatorial situation (as opposed to a threatening situation), fighting might not be the answer that saves your life. Fighting might get you or someone else killed. Now mind you, I'm not talking the average bully confrontation.

Consider my own quasi-stalking experience. It would not have been wise for me to confront that person alone. I got my housemates to support me in getting him to move out, and when things continued to escalate, contacted the police who indicated a peace bond was the next logical step (which I got). I used the legal tools at my disposal, I deliberately set up my personal activities (bussing, working, etc.) so that our physical paths would not cross. I didn't "fight", in the traditional sense of the word, I "fled". I didn't let him "get away with it", but I certainly didn't physicaly confront... I'm "sneakier" than that.

It might make me an asshole, but I am actively teaching my girls that there is a value to "Make yourself look unimportant. Don't draw attention. Get out fast." in order to attempt to avoid an escalation. Because in a physical confrontation, I/we are likely to loose, big time.

While I think there is a high value in "trust your gut : learn to avoid creepy people/situations" from the perpsective of your personal relationships, I think that's not nessecarily as useful in a "hurt by a stranger" scenario, which is probably the less frequent of what we will encounter in our lives. It's the ones you know that are going to get you, by and large.

I don't even know what I'm saying anymore. Obviously I have mixed feelings on the subject.

Date: 2006-06-16 05:05 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] garnigal.livejournal.com
No, you are definitely right. If your gut says "don't get in that situation", listen to your gut. That's exactly what I mean about trusting yourself.

Obviously, the fight like hell attitude is going to be most appropriate in a stranger attack - you don't know this person, and you can fight without compunction, knowing that he does not have good intentions.

But when else do you fight? When your mind has overruled your instincts (oh, X says he's okay, just a little intense) or someone is a little too friendly. Society would say "ask him to back off". I say "ask him to back off and make your displeasure known with and elbow in the solar plexis".

I know too many people who excuse overly familiar behaviour with a "he's just a touchy-feely kinda guy". Just like with a dog, you (the hypothetical person I just mentally beat down) should ask before you touch people.

I think people are far too hesitant to fight back when someone they know personally is acting in an agressive manner. Of course the best thing is to not get into that situation. But it takes experience to trust your gut, and even then there's often an unavoidable hidden creep in a large group. And that's the situation too many people hesitate. They are too concerned with not offending the other people that they put up with inappropriate and unpleasant situations rather than getting themselves out.

Granted, sometimes the elbow to the teeth isn't warranted. But words are weapons too. Someone deliberately belittling you? Call them on it.

I've never had occasion to go beyond removing myself from the situation or making a comment about not enjoying the conversation. But I know that if I had to I would.

And if I'm physically attacked, I know I'm going to fight. And if I lose - I still fought.

Date: 2006-06-16 06:35 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sandraregina.livejournal.com
'Fight like hell' doesn't always mean physically fighting. Banding together, getting the law on your side, etc. is all part of the fighting.

Date: 2006-06-16 06:38 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sandraregina.livejournal.com
True, we do have experience. I think one thing we can do is to talk with our girls and talk out situations and how to handle them, based on *what* is happening, not where it is.
And even I acknowledge that my refusing to be 'proper' and hide at home after dark might someday put me in a bad situation. If something happens - and I hope it never does - I hope that I'll react appropriately (i.e. run or claw like hell) and get out okay.

That's all I've got, really. Trust my instincts, refuse to be cowed 'just because' I'm female, have contingency plans if things go to fuck, and then...whatever happens, happens.

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